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I've read that The Ring magazine recognized Dean Detton and then Bronko Nagurski as the true world heavyweight champions of wrestling in the 1930s. That makes two out of four champions of the "Levin line" or "northeast version" of the World Heavyweight Title. What exactly was the reason of their crediting them with being the true champs, instead of the NWAssociation or AWAssociation champs, e.g., at the time? Did they also recognize Dave Levin (before Detton) and Jim Londos (after Nagurski) out of this line (which I haven't read anything about)?
[ 03-31-2009, 05:01 PM: Message edited by: Mark Madison ]
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They thought titles should be won in the ring & they recognized the Levin over Baba match as a title change. After Londos beat Bronko, and never lost, it all got forgotten. This was the Toots Mondt title line.--Yohe
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I believe RING MAGAZINE stared around 1925 (?) and the major coverage of wrestling started in 1930 with the increased popularity of the sport in NYC. It seemed to last until the 1960's, or until it started publishing RING WRESTLING magazine. Someone will know better than me.
When I was a kid, I thought THE RING was lost but after going thru all the old mags, which can be found at AAF SPORTS LIBRARY IN LOS ANGELES (2141 W. Adams Boulevard library@aafla.org), I found them to be a great source for info on how people thought about pro wrestling in the 30's etc. I made copies of most of the stories.--Yohe
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Steve, I went through the old Ring files when I was at the University of Illinois. There were a few that had torn pages that seemed to have info I needed for my world title research. Might you be able and/or willing to tell me what those pages say, if I can come up with the issue?
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For those interested, this information is from The Ring's official website (www.ringtv.com):
The Ring was founded in 1922 by Nat Fleischer. The first issue, dated February 15, 1922, and was 24 pages and cost 20 cents. The cover of the first issue featured black and white photographs of American promoter Tex Richard and Lord Lonsdale, a member of British aristocracy and boxing patron. Originally located in New York City, the magazine relocated to Long Island, New York, in 1990, and then moved to its current location, in suburban Pennsylvania in 1993.
The Ring has had five owners throughout its history: Nat Fleischer and family, Dave DeBusschere and Nick Kladis, Stanley Weston, Nick Karabots, and now Oscar De La Hoya.
There have been only six editors-in-chief in the magazine's history. Current editor Nigel Collins is the only editor to "regain the title," originally serving from 1985 until '89, then returning to the position in 1997. The Ring began awarding championship belts in 1922. The first Ring belt was awarded to heavyweight champion Jack Dempsey, the second to flyweight champion Pancho Villa. The magazine stopped giving belts to world champions in the 1990s, but began again in 2002 when it launched its new championship policy intended to reward fighters who, by satisfying rigid criteria, can justify a claim as the true and only world champion in a given weight class.
[ 03-31-2009, 07:42 PM: Message edited by: Mark Madison ]
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I've got some questions on the boxing/wrestling terminology:
In boxing, a contest between top contenders to decide the next challenger for a title is called an "eliminator fight", or simply an "eliminator". Has this ever been used for wrestling, too?
The second term is "decision match". I seldomly get to read it, but the term allegedly refers to a match for a vacant/held-up title between two top contenders, in order to decide who the new champion will be. Is that right or am I mistaken? Is this term more or less generally accepted and commonly used?
[ 04-01-2009, 05:50 PM: Message edited by: Mark Madison ]
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quote:Originally posted by Mark Madison: I've got some questions on the boxing/wrestling terminology:
In boxing, a contest between top contenders to decide the next challenger for a title is called an "eliminator fight", or simply an "eliminator". Has this ever been used for wrestling, too?
Yeah, 'title eliminator', 'elimination', whatever. Has been used in wrestling, but maybe '# 1 contender match' has been used more.
The second term is "decision match". I seldomly get to read it, but the term allegedly refers to a match for a vacant/held-up title between two top contenders, in order to decide who the new champion will be. Is that right or am I mistaken? Is this term more or less generally accepted and commonly used?
I have never heard that. Or anything other than 'title fight' for the 'vacant title'.
-------------------- Here is natural instinct and here is control. You are to combine the two in harmony. If you have one to the extreme, you will be very unscientific. If you have another to the extreme, you become all of a sudden a mechanical man. Be water, my friend.
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Thanks, CM. Paradoxically, that "decision match" term is from a non-English speaking source. The source is very reliable as far as information goes, but in this particular case I think they just translated the words from their language into English, making up a new term. I won't use it anymore.
[ 09-05-2009, 07:50 AM: Message edited by: Mark Madison ]
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Ah. Okay, I can see that, like the 'deciding' or 'decisive' fight for the vacant/held up title and that being mistranslated back to 'decision'.
-------------------- Here is natural instinct and here is control. You are to combine the two in harmony. If you have one to the extreme, you will be very unscientific. If you have another to the extreme, you become all of a sudden a mechanical man. Be water, my friend.
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The Ring's annual wrestling rankings for 1935 (by Jim Amann, appearing in the 03/1936 issue) list then-undisputed world champion Danno O'Mahoney at No. 1, because he is considered "the real champion, insofar as successorship is concerned." [information from the New WAWLI Papers #524]
The Ring's annual wrestling rankings for 1937 (by Nat Fleischer, appearing in the 03/1938 issue) recognize as "World Champion -- Bronko Nagurski, International Falls, Minn." [information from the New WAWLI Papers #530]
I thought this might fit in here. If someone happens to find some more of the magazine's championship recognition, it'd be really great. I'd love to see whether The Ring recognized anyone before the major titles were unified by O'Mahoney in 1935 or whether this unification was the cause for initial recognition. It would also be interesting to know when exactly "it all got forgotten", i.e. what the last issue that recognized Londos was (probably one from the early to mid-1940s).
[ 06-07-2010, 02:51 PM: Message edited by: Mark Madison ]
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During WWII the wrestling section got really small & maybe it was then that it lost it's direction and train of thought. During its major years I would consider it a "smart" publication, but sometimes its info was wrong.--Yohe
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