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Author Topic: Not Making This Up: Kendrick Lamar Wins Pulitzer Prize
Crimson Mask from FL
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http://variety.com/2018/music/news/kendrick-lamar-wins-pulitzer-prize-for-damn-1202754548/

Well... damn.

[ 04-22-2018, 12:05 PM: Message edited by: Crimson Mask from FL ]

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Ken Viewer
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Yeah, and schitt floats.

This is the genuinely-American music of the post-World-War-II-era that deserved the acclaim but never received it, or the money that comes with a Pulitzer, from the committee at Columbia University, which hands out the "awards:"



Ken

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Crimson Mask from FL
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Ken, get woke. If you can listen to Kendrick and call him sh*t, your ears are senile, too.

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Crimson Mask from FL
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... but you haven't listened to him. Have you.

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Crimson Mask from FL
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Crimson Mask from FL
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Open your ears. Open your mind. Listen.

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Ken Viewer
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quote:
Originally posted by Crimson Mask from FL:
... but you haven't listened to him. Have you.

Oh, yes, I have.

And I wrote what may be the first major newspaper article on the combining of rap music and break-dancing in 1984...ran for an entire broadsheet page back then and in at least three of the then-largest-circulation dailies in the United States.

Ken

[ 04-16-2018, 08:55 PM: Message edited by: Ken Viewer ]

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Crimson Mask from FL
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Then I don't get it. He's the real deal. What aren't you hearing?

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Ken Viewer
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If Columbia gives The Darnold a Pulitzer, will you go all-out for him?

I was providing the rap/breakdance artists with mainstream exposure long before this board existed and I didn't need Columbia University to tell me what is talent and what it isn't.

Ken

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Steve Ogilvie
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Whatever happened to the Breakdancing groups?

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Shaving Weezie Jefferson
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Ken's just bitter that he never won the Pulitzer Prize for Old Timey Wool Underwear Fightin'.

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This post isn't about wrestling. It is intended only to mock and criticize Richard Wallner.

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Shaving Weezie Jefferson
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quote:
Originally posted by Ken Viewer:
If Columbia gives The Darnold a Pulitzer, will you go all-out for him?

I was providing the rap/breakdance artists with mainstream exposure long before this board existed and I didn't need Columbia University to tell me what is talent and what it isn't.

Ken

That's mighty white of you.

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This post isn't about wrestling. It is intended only to mock and criticize Richard Wallner.

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Crimson Mask from FL
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I remain baffled at the implication that doo wop with its moon June spoon lyrics, no matter how much its harmonies obviously influence Kendrick Lamar as anybody with an ear could tell if they listen to even the first track of that album, is somehow more Pulitzer Prize worthy THAN that album. This guy is changing the game. I don't see how anybody can fail to hear that.

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Crimson Mask from FL
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And see that. I mean... he just won the Pulitzer. If this is not an acknowledgement of the legitimization of black American music, just what in the f*ck IS it?

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Crimson Mask from FL
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quote:
Originally posted by Ken Viewer:
If Columbia gives The Darnold a Pulitzer, will you go all-out for him?

What the f*ck does that even mean? I was all out for Kendrick Lamar since the first time I heard him.

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Gnome Cold
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As someone who primarily listens to classical music, I was delighted to hear the news.
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Gnome Cold
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I suppose I should clarify that I was not being sarcastic.
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HEN from MS
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So is it that Ken has beef with the Pulitzer and Columbia University?

Was the "schitt floats" comment really directed at Kendrick Lamar's music?

quote:
Originally posted by Steve Ogilvie:
Whatever happened to the Breakdancing groups?

They still exist.

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Tatsuya
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quote:
Originally posted by Steve Ogilvie:
Whatever happened to the Breakdancing groups?

The Rock Steady Crew is still around.
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Zealot
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quote:
Originally posted by Crimson Mask from FL:
And see that. I mean... he just won the Pulitzer. If this is not an acknowledgement of the legitimization of black American music, just what in the f*ck IS it?

I don't think hip hop/rap needed the Pulitzer to be legitimized.

It's as "American" as country, rock 'n' roll, gospel, soul ... whatever. It's apart of our culture, white, black, yellow, red, whatever.

There a group of us - don't know how large we are, who believe it's not what it used to be, however. I listened to Run DMC and NWA in the day ... I listened to Rapper's Delight, Grandmaster Flash and The Furious Five, and the Sugarhill Gang ... but I don't listen to it anymore. I'm sad to say I've never listened to Kendrick Lamar. Maybe I need to. But there is no reason to bash Ken because he doesn't agree that Lamar doesn't equal what's come before him. Music is all about opinion. It's his right.

As for the Pulitzer, it's time has come and gone, if it ever had a time. We really don't need a bunch of academics to sit around in an ivory tower and tell us what is culturally relevant and what's not.

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Kilroy
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quote:
I don't think hip hop/rap needed the Pulitzer to be legitimized.

......

As for the Pulitzer, it's time has come and gone, if it ever had a time. We really don't need a bunch of academics to sit around in an ivory tower and tell us what is culturally relevant and what's not.

Spot. On.

[ 04-17-2018, 12:38 PM: Message edited by: Kilroy ]

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Crimson Mask from FL
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You guys are all missing the point. No we don't need them to but the fact that they are signals a sea change. Am I the only one here who can see that?

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Zealot
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quote:
Originally posted by Crimson Mask from FL:
You guys are all missing the point. No we don't need them to but the fact that they are signals a sea change. Am I the only one here who can see that?

I see what you're saying, but you're giving the Pulitzer people too much power.

Hip hop does their thing with or without the establishment's OK ... the breakin, the graffiti, the MC'n, the double dutch, it was all about being different, doin your thing.

If "they" say they get you, maybe it's time to change what you sayin'. I can't imagine Cube getting an award from the "establishment", let alone accepting it.

But I'm old.

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Gabba Hey
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I listened to the whole album. It isn't my thing, nor is most music nowadays. I'm glad he won a Pullitzer, by know means do I consider this groundbreaking on any level. A Pullitzer is barely even relevant in the music industry these days. Looking at the finalists I wouldn't even have an opinion on how to judge a winner. Or how the Board determines a winner, when it comes to music. Maybe 2% of America could name a past Pullitzer winner for Music. Take out Wynton Marsalis, and that list is irrelevant in the last 50 years, as far as the public is concerned. The album is good in its own right, but I highly doubt I'll ever listen to it again. Doesn't make my list of great albums, but it wasn't meant for me.

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Crimson Mask from FL
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Jesus Christ am I working the wrong room.

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KobashiChop
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Dude, its never August here.
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Ken Viewer
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quote:
Originally posted by Crimson Mask from FL:
You guys are all missing the point. No we don't need them to but the fact that they are signals a sea change. Am I the only one here who can see that?

No, we're not missing the point. But perhaps you are. It might help if you didn't feel you needed a justification for your fandom of rap/hip-hop music.

The people of the world make their own choices on merit when it's made known an artist's work is available for purchase, reading/viewing/listening-to (or, in case of this year's award, Lamar Kendrick received the award for what was a group effort) and they vote with their time and money.

The Pulitzer is an award that requires a publication, organization, an artist or a print-newsperson pay a fee to enter and artists or their backers can nominate themselves, as long as they pay to play (the $15,000 that comes with the award makes this whole thing an opportunity to bet on your candidate or yourself).

Roughly five people, chosen in a non-public manner, although often previous winners, make the decision for each category. It's not like the Academy Awards -- not that the Oscars end up going to the most deserving each time. People on Pulitzer committees have been known to vote for their friends who will perhaps return the favor...

I knew one guy who apparently nominated himself each year for over 30 years (he never won, and, no, it was not me). He may have enjoyed paying the entry fees.

Too many of the music awards have gone to composers/creators whose work has no audience, as evidenced by the empty concert halls at music centers when the works of "Modern Music" composers are regularly performed so they can be given the award. To quote from a reported interview given in 2003, "John Corigliano, the winner in 2001, said that although the prize was intended for music that meant something to the world, it had become a very different kind of award, 'by composers for composers' and 'mired in a pool of rotating jurors...'"

In the performing arts, the Pulitzer Prize is not something I have much respect for, and black composers/creators have never had to wait for this year's award for justification for their art. If this latest award makes you feel better, fine. To me, that award doesn't mean anything and I generally stay with the music I either grew up with or developed an attachment to, such as grand opera.

Those of us who gave serious consideration, and exposure, to rap music decades ago, when it was radically different than what had gone before, have done more to help provide an audience to rap than an award from five semi-anonymous people this year.

As for the question of what happened to break-dancing, it, like black dancers to this day, didn't get the opportunity to have the very-necessary free-rehearsal-studio space, volunteer dancers, and to develop enough choreographers to get it into the mainstream of ballet companies or enough Modern Dance troupes. I'd guess it's alive and well in clubs, since I no longer attend evening performances.

The first American-born black man to dance Romeo in a full-evening version of "Romeo and Juliet," by John Cranko as adapted from the Shakespeare, on the stage of New York's Metropolitan Opera House, had to go off to Europe and join a German ballet company to get his chance...and his Juliet was a white woman. That still hasn't happened in an American dance company that has played at Lincoln Center.

I was there at one meeting where black New York fans (the fellow was from Brooklyn) urged him not to join the Dance Theatre of Harlem but instead to go to the Stuttgart Ballet instead, as a member of the "underground" fans group in New York City. And he followed their advice. He was a great classical dancer who died young... He didn't need a Pulitzer Prize (there isn't any for dance) in order to get out there and master his art.

Ken

[ 04-17-2018, 06:21 PM: Message edited by: Ken Viewer ]

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TheMadStepDad
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quote:
Originally posted by Crimson Mask from FL:
You guys are all missing the point. No we don't need them to but the fact that they are signals a sea change. Am I the only one here who can see that?

Co-sign 100%. I couldn't agree with you more.
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Steve Ogilvie
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quote:
Originally posted by Zealot:
quote:
Originally posted by Crimson Mask from FL:
You guys are all missing the point. No we don't need them to but the fact that they are signals a sea change. Am I the only one here who can see that?

I see what you're saying, but you're giving the Pulitzer people too much power.

Hip hop does their thing with or without the establishment's OK ... the breakin, the graffiti, the MC'n, the double dutch, it was all about being different, doin your thing.

If "they" say they get you, maybe it's time to change what you sayin'. I can't imagine Cube getting an award from the "establishment", let alone accepting it.

But I'm old.

Sounds like it, those are all old hat references.

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Ta-Kargol, Lord Of The Volcano
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quote:
Originally posted by Crimson Mask from FL:
You guys are all missing the point. No we don't need them to but the fact that they are signals a sea change. Am I the only one here who can see that?

Either that or they are following the example of the Nobel Prize for Literature committee.

To be frank, I didn't even know there was a Pulitzer for music. Probably because it seems to have been a jazz/classical holdout. Two forms of music for which I have a tin ear.

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Crimson Mask from FL
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quote:
Originally posted by KobashiChop:
Dude, its never August here.

Ain't dat de troot.

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Crimson Mask from FL
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btw I don't need 'justification' for my imaginary 'fandom' of music that I actually play. Every musician I know, which includes guys who play on his records, thinks this is cool as sh*t. Another beachhead taken.

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OSJ from NM by way of WA
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quote:
Originally posted by Crimson Mask from FL:
You guys are all missing the point. No we don't need them to but the fact that they are signals a sea change. Am I the only one here who can see that?

Damn, I didn't read the thread previously as I assumed it would just be filled with "About time!" and "They got it right!" posts, which while cool are not something that draws my attention. Instead I find a champion of grand opera writing "schitt floats" at the same time he pats himself on the back for listening to a rap album twenty years ago. Very white of you, Ken.

That anyone doesn't see this as part of a sea change is to me, somewhat incredible.

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-Franz Kafka - The Trial

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midsouthfan from N.O.
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My only experience with him was the Super Bowl and it definitely didn't grab me. At my next break I'll listen a little more - maybe the recording studio version is better on me.
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Handsome Rob from LA
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Sales increase for Lamar’s ‘Damn’ 236% week after he wins Pulitzer. Can only assume this is a coincidence since the tastemakers of pop culture at WCMB think Pulitzers don’t meant anything anymore.

http://www.thefader.com/2018/04/26/kendrick-lamar-damn-sales-increase

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