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Author Topic: Trump convinces Israel to bar entry to two Congresswomen
Red Wings Fan I
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Herr Gropenfuhrer has convinced Israel to deny entry to Ilhan Omar and Rashida Tlaib. This is probably example #3,732 of 45 doing something that pleases his base but makes everyone else believe he's a petty, vindictive a**hole.

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Crimson Mask from FL
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Netanyahoo probably didn't need much convincing. Although to be fair Omar seems to have about the same level of ingrained anti-Semitism as tRumpy himself.

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Travlr
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According toe Israeli journalist Barak Ravid BennyNet didn't say a peep about it -- even knowing weeks ago that Omar and Tlaib already supported BDS -- and agreed to let them in until Trump put some pressure on him yesterday.

[ 08-15-2019, 12:43 PM: Message edited by: Travlr ]

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"Reputation is what others think about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. The friction tends to arise when the two are not the same.... Guard your honor; let your reputation fall where it may."

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diamondmd
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Maybe I've missed something but all I've heard about Omar is she criticized Netanyahu and the lobbyists who try to to influence (read pay) congress to be favorable to Isreal. I don't see that as anti- Semitism. I see no difference in that and criticism of any other influence (read bribe) over congress.
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Crimson Mask from FL
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Yeah you have missed something. Just like tRump it surfaces in her casual comments. Like proclaiming herself the first refugee Congress person when there were several Jewish refugees in Congress decades ago.

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diamondmd
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Ok, gotcha. Pretty dumb on her part.
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Commish from California
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Steve King, meanwhile, is not banned.
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TVO
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Why should Israel let people who actively call for their destruction into their country?

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Dirko
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quote:
Originally posted by TVO:
Why should Israel let people who actively call for their destruction into their country?

Quotes and sources, please!

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King Francis
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quote:
Originally posted by Dirko:
quote:
Originally posted by TVO:
Why should Israel let people who actively call for their destruction into their country?

Quotes and sources, please!
Ttump says so..

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When I said that was the most ignorant thing I ever heard, I didn't realize you were still talking.

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King Francis
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Ttump say so.... what else does one need?

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When I said that was the most ignorant thing I ever heard, I didn't realize you were still talking.

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Travlr
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Tlaib will now be allowed in. Humanitarian grounds are being given as the reason (she's going to visit her parents in the West Bank).

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The Traveller
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Travlr
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And now the WaPo is reporting that Tlaib will not visit Israel "under these oppressive conditions".

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The Traveller
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"Reputation is what others think about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. The friction tends to arise when the two are not the same.... Guard your honor; let your reputation fall where it may."

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King Francis
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quote:
Originally posted by Travlr:
And now the WaPo is reporting that Tlaib will not visit Israel "under these oppressive conditions".

good for her. I agree that any country can ban someone from coming into their country. They should do that on their own and not based upon Ttump's comments.

but NetenYAHOO and Cadet Bone Spurs are 2 of the same.. both under investigations in their countries. not surprising what they did

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When I said that was the most ignorant thing I ever heard, I didn't realize you were still talking.

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K. Fabian McClinch
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quote:
Originally posted by TVO:
Why should Israel let people who actively call for their destruction into their country?

They called for a boycott. Whether or not we agree with that, it's NOT "destruction."

[ 08-16-2019, 04:10 PM: Message edited by: K. Fabian McClinch ]

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1000 Masks But No Jobs
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quote:
Originally posted by diamondmd:
Maybe I've missed something but all I've heard about Omar is she criticized Netanyahu and the lobbyists who try to to influence (read pay) congress to be favorable to Isreal. I don't see that as anti- Semitism. I see no difference in that and criticism of any other influence (read bribe) over congress.

You are missing something. Her quote about Israel hyponotizing the world is a lot worse than the quote about the Benjamins, IMO.

“Israel has hypnotized the world, may Allah awaken the people and help them see the evil doings of Israel.”

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/3/6/18251639/ilhan-omar-israel-anti-semitism-jews

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diamondmd
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And just what is any different from so called Christians claiming God causes earthquakes because of the gay or that school shootings happened because the guvmint took prayer out of schools? Is it just because she mentions the wrong "God"?

What she is saying is basically true. The US provides Isreal 3 billion dollars a year fo what exactly? We allow a foreign power to dictate our foreign policy thru a powerful lobbyist.
And what the Isreali government is doing to the Palestinians is evil.

[ 08-17-2019, 11:33 AM: Message edited by: diamondmd ]

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1000 Masks But No Jobs
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quote:
Originally posted by diamondmd:
And just what is any different from so called Christians claiming God causes earthquakes because of the gay or that school shootings happened because the guvmint took prayer out of schools? Is it just because she mentions the wrong "God"?

What she is saying is basically true. The US provides Isreal 3 billion dollars a year fo what exactly? We allow a foreign power to dictate our foreign policy thru a powerful lobbyist.
And what the Isreali government is doing to the Palestinians is evil.

You asked if you are missing something. I replied with the Omar quote that you were missing, then you want to to play whataboutism. That Omar quote isn't anti--semitic?

Why ask if you didn't want to know that you were missing her more problematic quote?

For the record, someone saying God causes earthquakes because of homosexuality is stupid, although that does not have anything at all to do with what you asked.

[ 08-17-2019, 01:10 PM: Message edited by: 1000 Masks But No Jobs ]

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Crimson Mask from FL
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I am no fan of Netanyahoo but if you do not understand why Israel uses survival tactics, go look at a f****** map. You got a country about the size of the State of Florida minus the Panhandle smack dab in the f****** middle of an entire subcontinent of countries which have sworn to wipe it off the map. And I will remind you that the two-state solution was an option on the table in 1948 and it was the Palestinians who refused it.

[ 08-20-2019, 06:41 AM: Message edited by: Crimson Mask from FL ]

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Travlr
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Not one of my usual sites (by a long shot!), but came up through my FB feed: 'We Will Have Her Back': Jewish Constituents Rally Behind Rashida Tlaib Amid Trump Attacks.


Seems her grandmother had a few things to say in a Now This interview as well. Including, "May God ruin him."

Intersting choice of words, I think....

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The Traveller
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K. Fabian McClinch
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quote:
Originally posted by Travlr:
. . .
Seems her grandmother had a few things to say in a Now This interview as well. Including, "May God ruin him."

Intersting choice of words, I think....

Sorry, Jadaty, but unfortunately, if "God" (by whatever name) bothered to "ruin" despots, tyrants, incompetent buffoons, racist megalomaniacs, or any of the other varieties of human dreggery that have led, dominated, tyrannized, occupied, taken over, and otherwise wreaked their evil on various societies, countries, and civilizations in both distant and recent history, that history would be a lot different, and a lot less nightmarish, than it has been and is.

I'm afraid that Whoever/Whatever is "up there" looking down on this cesspool decided long ago that He/She/It had much better things to do than try to bail us out or rescue us from our own self-made hells.

[ 08-18-2019, 05:42 PM: Message edited by: K. Fabian McClinch ]

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TVO
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Dirko,

For starters Talib and Omar trip was sponsored by Miftah a group that supports the genocide of Israelis.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/cnn-panel-erupts-over-tlaib-and-omar-connection-to-anti-semitic-group

Israel has again the right to choose who can enter their own country especially from individuals who are tied to organization that support genocide of its people.

You want to hear about not being allowed into a place to visit I cannot visit most of my ancestral land just outside of Hebron where part of my family was massacred in 1929. If I would walk around this area I would be shot no questions asked.

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Dirko
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quote:
Originally posted by TVO:
Dirko,

For starters Talib and Omar trip was sponsored by Miftah a group that supports the genocide of Israelis.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/cnn-panel-erupts-over-tlaib-and-omar-connection-to-anti-semitic-group

That doesn't sound good. I am not a fan of any groups that advocate violence.

Israel has again the right to choose who can enter their own country especially from individuals who are tied to organization that support genocide of its people.

That's what national sovereignty is all about.

You want to hear about not being allowed into a place to visit I cannot visit most of my ancestral land just outside of Hebron where part of my family was massacred in 1929. If I would walk around this area I would be shot no questions asked.

Sorry to hear that.


quote:
Why should Israel let people who actively call for their destruction into their country?


Sources and quotes, please!

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TVO
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Dirk, the source is the link in my last post that shows that the organization that is sponsoring them supports Israel’s destruction.

This is like someone being sponsored by the KKK and clamming they do not support white supremacy.

Also see this article -https://thebulwark.com/the-problem-with-miftah/

Quotes from the 2nd article - The group celebrates terrorists, including an evil woman who helped murder 13 Israeli children. In an article titled “Let Us Honor Our Own,” a Miftah contributor describes Dalal Al Mughrabi as “a Palestinian fighter who was killed during a military operation against Israel in 1978” and as one of the Palestinian people’s “national heroes.”
The so-called “military operation” is more widely known as the “Coastal Road Massacre,” a bus hijacking that resulted in the deaths of 38 Israeli civilians, including 13 children.

Al Mughrabi is hardly the only terrorist Miftah celebrates. It described female suicide bomber Wafa Idrees as the “the beginning of a string of Palestinian women dedicated to sacrificing their lives for the cause.” It singles out for recognition Hanadi Jaradat, a woman who blew herself up in a restaurant, killing 21 people (including four children).

The founder of Miftah herself, Ms. Ashrawi, excused jihadist violence by telling an interviewer that “you cannot somehow adopt the language of either the international community or the occupier by describing anybody who resists as terrorist.”

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King Francis
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saw this a couple of days ago....

… WELL, MIFTAH has sponsored trips for members of Congress in the past, and Israel has let them in the country.

IN 2016, Reps. MATT CARTWRIGHT (D-Pa.), DAN KILDEE (D-Mich.), MARK POCAN (D-Wis.), LUIS GUTIERREZ (D-Ill.) and HANK JOHNSON (D-Ga.) all went on a five-day trip to Israel and the West Bank sponsored by the group.

-- THE TRIP, which was between May 26 and June 1, 2016, was sponsored by the American Global Institute in addition to Miftah.

I know nothing about the group. But what is different between the group that was allowed in sponsored by this group, and the ones rejected who also were sponsored by this group?

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When I said that was the most ignorant thing I ever heard, I didn't realize you were still talking.

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TVO
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King Francis,

Again Israel can pick and choose who they let in. I also think it was a mistake in the past to let people into Israel who are sponsored by a terrorist group.

In addition under new Israel law Omar and Tlaib BDS support makes it illegal for them to enter the Country. Israel could have made an exception by why should they? Would you want a group sponsored by the KKK entering your country?

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Crimson Mask from FL
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http://www.jta.org/quick-reads/tlaib-calls-for-boycott-of-bill-maher-show-after-he-calls-bds-a-bullst-purity-test

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Dirko
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quote:
Originally posted by TVO:
King Francis,

Again Israel can pick and choose who they let in. I also think it was a mistake in the past to let people into Israel who are sponsored by a terrorist group.

In addition under new Israel law Omar and Tlaib BDS support makes it illegal for them to enter the Country. Israel could have made an exception by why should they? Would you want a group sponsored by the KKK entering your country?

And do you realise the difference between this post and stating something like "Why should Israel let people who actively call for their destruction into their country?" ?

I still might have a different viewpoint than you, but at least I can't accuse you of using hyperbole and we can talk about facts, laws and realpolitik. (And I will overlook the false equivalence, tu quoque and missing middle fallacies.)

I understand that this is an emotionally charged issue. At the same time, we all think that we're right and feeling outraged when discussing issues will never convince others of our point of view.

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TVO
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Dirko,

You are quite incorrect being sponsored by a group that supports terrorism makes you part of that group. Would you want a group sponsored by the KKK entering your country? Would they not be racists?
You also may not think support of BDS is not calling for destruction of Israel again that would be incorrect.

Btw the links and quotes do cover this but you have your own agenda and that is ok [Smile]

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K. Fabian McClinch
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This is going to split the progressive "wing" right down the middle, and T-Rump is gonna barrel through that fissure like a Mack truck.

(Actually, it's split the U.S. "left" for quite some time, although a lot of people don't want to talk about / admit it.)

[ 08-20-2019, 01:04 PM: Message edited by: K. Fabian McClinch ]

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King Francis
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quote:
Originally posted by TVO:
King Francis,

Again Israel can pick and choose who they let in. I also think it was a mistake in the past to let people into Israel who are sponsored by a terrorist group.

In addition under new Israel law Omar and Tlaib BDS support makes it illegal for them to enter the Country. Israel could have made an exception by why should they? Would you want a group sponsored by the KKK entering your country?

TVO.... AGAIN FROM A EARLIER POST OF MINE

good for her. I agree that any country can ban someone from coming into their country. They should do that on their own and not based upon Ttump's comments.

but NetenYAHOO and Cadet Bone Spurs are 2 of the same.. both under investigations in their countries. not surprising what they did

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the question I asked is what is the difference between the ones sponsored by this group who were allowed to visit and the ones that were rejected and/or had limitations put on their speech?

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When I said that was the most ignorant thing I ever heard, I didn't realize you were still talking.

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PsychoSem
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Talib was trolling from the beginning I think.

All she did was expose herself.

They agreed to give her clearance to visit her grandmother after she complained how this might be the last time she would ever see her.

Then she did a 180 and said she wouldn't go because she was being oppressed. I guess granny didn't really matter than much in the grand scheme of things to her, just something to stir people up.

Is it really too much to say hey you can enter, just don't bash us while you are here if this is really supposed to be a family visit?

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TVO
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Funny how some people think Tlaib does not belive in the destuction of Israel as she is the same person who said the slaughter of six million Jews in the Holocaust gave her “a calming feeling.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/13/us/politics/rashida-tlaib-holocaust.html

Again why should Israel lets her and her tag-team partner Omar into Israel. Israel did the right thing and the majority of Israel agrees.

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Crimson Mask from FL
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Anti-Semitism: the one thing the rest of the world agrees on.

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diamondmd
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quote:
Originally posted by Crimson Mask from FL:
Anti-Semitism: the one thing the rest of the world agrees on.

Except the Cheeto Benito. He thinks Jewish people who vote for Democrats are anti-American and disloyal to Israel.
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K. Fabian McClinch
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quote:
Originally posted by TVO:
Funny how some people think Tlaib does not belive in the destuction of Israel as she is the same person who said the slaughter of six million Jews in the Holocaust gave her “a calming feeling.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/13/us/politics/rashida-tlaib-holocaust.html

Again why should Israel lets her and her tag-team partner Omar into Israel. Israel did the right thing and the majority of Israel agrees.

Please re-read that article. She NEVER said that the Holocaust gives her a "calming feeling." In fact, she implied the opposite: She praised her ancestors for ceding part of "their" land to the founders of Israel after the Holocaust:

“All of it was in the name of trying to create a safe haven for Jews, post the Holocaust, post the tragedy and horrific persecution of Jews across the world at that time . . .And, I love the fact that it was my ancestors that provided that, right?”

We can argue about whether or not it was "their" land to give in the first place, and we can certainly argue about whether she's justified in thinking that that legacy has somehow been betrayed by subsequent actions on the part of Israel, but let's not go "Godwin" on her and misrepresent what she said in this manner.

[ 08-21-2019, 08:21 AM: Message edited by: K. Fabian McClinch ]

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King Francis
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from same article:

But in Republicans’ telling, Ms. Tlaib never uttered the words “tragedy and horrific persecution of Jews.” Instead, Representatives Steve Scalise and Liz Cheney, the No. 2 and No. 3 Republicans in the House, seized on the words “calming feeling” in the headlines of back-to-back statements they issued Sunday casting Ms. Tlaib as an anti-Semite.

if one posts an article to support their views, one may want to read it.. just saying

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When I said that was the most ignorant thing I ever heard, I didn't realize you were still talking.

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Crimson Mask from FL
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quote:
Originally posted by diamondmd:
quote:
Originally posted by Crimson Mask from FL:
Anti-Semitism: the one thing the rest of the world agrees on.

Except the Cheeto Benito. He thinks Jewish people who vote for Democrats are anti-American and disloyal to Israel.
No, that just further solidifies him as an anti-semite, putting him right in step with everybody else.

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TVO
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Only an anti-semite would say the holocaust gives you a calm feeling. She or you can justify this all you want but Who says such a thing. Also her people rarley if never helped Jews after the Holcaust. The opposiate is true as soon as the survivors arrived they were forced to fight allongside native Isralies in 1948 against 5+ Arab 5 armies.

I guess you do not consider her taste in cartoons anti-semtic either?

https://www.jns.org/adl-jewish-groups-criticize-omar-tlaib-for-sharing-anti-semitic-cartoon/

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TVO
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Mask is correct both the extreme right and left all hate Jews and Israel!

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