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Author Topic: Joe Lockhart says it best...
Dragonstone
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I wish there was a way to embed tweets on this forum, but since there isn't, I'll just quote his tweet verbatim:
quote:
Anyone who supports a racist or a racist strategy is a racist themselves. 2020 is a moment or reckoning for America. Vote for @realDonaldTrump and you are a racist. Don’t hide it like a coward. Wear that racist badge proudly and see how it feels.
Amen, brother.

I'll give every single 2016 Trump voter a pass on not knowing just how racist this dude really is. But if you vote for him again in 2020, you get no such pass. You are a knowingly voting for a racist, you are enabling racism, and therefore you are a racist yourself. End of discussion.

[ 07-28-2019, 07:40 PM: Message edited by: Dragonstone ]

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1000 Masks But No Jobs
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I don't know that calling as many people as possible racist is really a motivational strategy. In 2016, Hillary called her opponent's supporters deplorable, then lost.

If the Dems really run on calling as many people as possible racist, I think Trump could win again. Biden cleans up in general election polling, and that isn't his message at all.

One of the big reasons the Dems lost the entire Rust Belt in 2016 was because they allowed Trump and Republicans to talk about jobs. The Dems are really going to go down that road again?

[ 07-28-2019, 08:27 PM: Message edited by: 1000 Masks But No Jobs ]

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Dragonstone
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If you vote for Donald Trump in 2020, you are a racist. Period. There is nothing to discuss about it.

This is my personal sentiment, and I don't speak for all Democrats or the Democratic Party in general.

[ 07-28-2019, 10:19 PM: Message edited by: Dragonstone ]

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Crimson Mask from FL
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Newsflash: racists aren't insulted by being called what they are. They're already proud of it, even if some of them outwardly feign being offended.

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King Francis
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or the answer..I dont believe that I am racist...

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When I said that was the most ignorant thing I ever heard, I didn't realize you were still talking.

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PsychoSem
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Weren't the other Dem candidates calling Biden a racist too?

So we should all vote 3rd party if he gets the nomination I guess?

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Dirko
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quote:
Originally posted by Dragonstone:
If you vote for Donald Trump in 2020, you are a racist. Period. There is nothing to discuss about it.

This is my personal sentiment, and I don't speak for all Democrats or the Democratic Party in general.

But aren't you then also an anti-intellectual, deplorable, fact-hating, bigoted, homophobic, boorish sexist?

Do you think that racism is the one accusation that will get people to re-evaluate their voting intentions?

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King Francis
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quote:
Originally posted by Dirko:
quote:
Originally posted by Dragonstone:
If you vote for Donald Trump in 2020, you are a racist. Period. There is nothing to discuss about it.

This is my personal sentiment, and I don't speak for all Democrats or the Democratic Party in general.

But aren't you then also an anti-intellectual, deplorable, fact-hating, bigoted, homophobic, boorish sexist?

Do you think that racism is the one accusation that will get people to re-evaluate their voting intentions?

no... they dont believe they are racist, or in today's world, they are proud of it and blame it on P/C...`

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When I said that was the most ignorant thing I ever heard, I didn't realize you were still talking.

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1000 Masks But No Jobs
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quote:
Originally posted by Dragonstone:
If you vote for Donald Trump in 2020, you are a racist. Period. There is nothing to discuss about it.

This is my personal sentiment, and I don't speak for all Democrats or the Democratic Party in general.

Eh...the problem with painting everyone with broad strokes is that broad strokes don't work anymore than Republicans who paint everyone who votes Democrat as a socialist leech wanting a handout. That characterization isn't true, either. Painting everyone who disagrees with you with one broad brush doesn't work.

[ 07-29-2019, 08:48 AM: Message edited by: 1000 Masks But No Jobs ]

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diamondmd
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quote:
Originally posted by 1000 Masks But No Jobs:
quote:
Originally posted by Dragonstone:
If you vote for Donald Trump in 2020, you are a racist. Period. There is nothing to discuss about it.

This is my personal sentiment, and I don't speak for all Democrats or the Democratic Party in general.

Eh...the problem with painting everyone with broad strokes is that broad strokes don't work anymore than Republicans who paint everyone who votes Democrat as a socialist leech wanting a handout. That characterization isn't true, either. Painting everyone who disagrees with you with one broad brush doesn't work.
Problem with your assessment is that tRump is a racist. He hates a certain section of this country because of the color of their skin. He has a long history of it and it was well documented. Even before you voted for him. So you voted for him knowing he hated a certain section of the poplulation of the country he is sworn to serve. So if you vote for him again knowing he is a racist means you agree with his racism or are willing to look the other way because you think there is something in it for you. So that makes you racist as well. No broad brush needed.
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1000 Masks But No Jobs
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quote:
Originally posted by diamondmd:
quote:
Originally posted by 1000 Masks But No Jobs:
quote:
Originally posted by Dragonstone:
If you vote for Donald Trump in 2020, you are a racist. Period. There is nothing to discuss about it.

This is my personal sentiment, and I don't speak for all Democrats or the Democratic Party in general.

Eh...the problem with painting everyone with broad strokes is that broad strokes don't work anymore than Republicans who paint everyone who votes Democrat as a socialist leech wanting a handout. That characterization isn't true, either. Painting everyone who disagrees with you with one broad brush doesn't work.
Problem with your assessment is that tRump is a racist. He hates a certain section of this country because of the color of their skin. He has a long history of it and it was well documented. Even before you voted for him. So you voted for him knowing he hated a certain section of the poplulation of the country he is sworn to serve. So if you vote for him again knowing he is a racist means you agree with his racism or are willing to look the other way because you think there is something in it for you. So that makes you racist as well. No broad brush needed.
Obama is actually a white guy? I voted for him twice, and have said so often on here. I would have voted for Obama in a heartbeat over either of the 2016 candidates.

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K. Fabian McClinch
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Please don't think I'm playing any "cards" here, because I mean this with no malice, hostility, or name-calling intended or implied -- but (speaking as a melanin-impaired guy myself), I'm afraid that one of the perks of that dreaded condition called "white privilege" is the leeway to decide that it's safe enough (for oneself) to vote for a known racist, bargaining that nothing "really bad" will happen under his tenure, because he's the lesser of two evils. In other words, his racism doesn't automatically hike up his "evilness" quotient beyond redemption.

A person of color cannot afford to do that -- one's very life depends on it. Open, unabashed racism is THE deal-breaker, no matter what else may be on the table.

[ 07-29-2019, 12:22 PM: Message edited by: K. Fabian McClinch ]

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1000 Masks But No Jobs
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quote:
Originally posted by K. Fabian McClinch:
Please don't think I'm playing any "cards" here, because I mean this with no malice, hostility, or name-calling intended or implied -- but (speaking as a melanin-impaired guy myself), I'm afraid that one of the perks of that dreaded condition called "white privilege" is the leeway to decide that it's safe enough (for oneself) to vote for a known racist, bargaining that nothing "really bad" will happen under his tenure, because he's the lesser of two evils. In other words, his racism doesn't automatically hike up his "evilness" quotient beyond redemption.

A person of color cannot afford to do that -- one's very life depends on it. Open, unabashed racism is THE deal-breaker, no matter what else may be on the table.

I don't even disagree with that. Two of the huge Republican constituencies are people who are pro-life and pro gun. I disagree with the Republicans on both those topics, but it is disingenuous to paint everyone who doesn't vote Democrat as a racist when people vote the way they do for a variety of reasons.

I have several co workers who I would never consider racist, but have made the comment that they will never vote for a Democrat because of guns.

Along those same lines, there are lots of people who vote Democrat because they are concerned about climate change, not because they are a socialist looking for a handout.

[ 07-29-2019, 12:35 PM: Message edited by: 1000 Masks But No Jobs ]

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Dragonstone
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quote:
Originally posted by PsychoSem:
Weren't the other Dem candidates calling Biden a racist too?

So we should all vote 3rd party if he gets the nomination I guess?

Not one Democratic presidential candidate has called Joe Biden a racist. Challenging him on his record on controversial race-related issues like busing is not the same thing as "calling him a racist".

Stop making **** up.

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Dragonstone
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quote:
Originally posted by 1000 Masks But No Jobs:
quote:
Originally posted by Dragonstone:
If you vote for Donald Trump in 2020, you are a racist. Period. There is nothing to discuss about it.

This is my personal sentiment, and I don't speak for all Democrats or the Democratic Party in general.

Eh...the problem with painting everyone with broad strokes is that broad strokes don't work anymore than Republicans who paint everyone who votes Democrat as a socialist leech wanting a handout. That characterization isn't true, either. Painting everyone who disagrees with you with one broad brush doesn't work.
That's nice.

Fact: Donald Trump is a racist. This is an indisputable fact. If we can't agree on this basic fact, there's no point in having any conversation whatsoever, because we clearly occupy very different realities.

Accepting the fact that Donald Trump is a racist means accepting the fact that acting in a way that helps Trump to remain president is an act which enables racism. A vote for Trump in 2020 is an act that will help Trump to remain president. Thus, it is an act which enables racism. A person who knowingly chooses to do something which enables racism is themselves a racist. Ergo... a person who votes for Trump in 2020 is a racist.

This isn't an invitation to try to change my mind on the matter. If you tell me that you are going to vote for Trump in 2020, I will tell you that you are a racist. You don't have to vote for the Democrat - or anybody for that matter - but if you vote for the racist, then you are a racist. You are free to disagree with my assessment - but it's not going to change my assessment. It's non-negotiable.

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Dragonstone
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quote:
Originally posted by 1000 Masks But No Jobs:
I disagree with the Republicans on both those topics, but it is disingenuous to paint everyone who doesn't vote Democrat as a racist when people vote the way they do for a variety of reasons.

Don't twist what I said. Nowhere did I say that someone who doesn't vote Democrat is a racist. Nor did I say that everyone who voted for Trump in 2016 is a racist. Quite the contrary, I said that I'm more than willing to give a lot of 2016 Trump voters the benefit of the doubt because maybe they weren't fully aware of Mr. Trump's long, well-documented history of racism.

I also didn't say that people who vote for Trump are doing so primarily because of his racism. I'm sure there are plenty of Trump voters whose main concern is abortion or guns or whatever. But they no longer get a pass for looking away from the racism just because it isn't their personal principle reason for supporting the man. Passive support for racism is still support for racism. Hitler made the trains run on time, and I'm sure there were plenty of Germans who personally didn't care for the whole gassing of six million Jews thing, but they still chose to support the man because... he made the trains run on time. They don't get a pass. Neither does the Republican who swears he isn't "personally" a racist, but chooses to vote for Trump in 2020 anyway because abortion.

If you vote for Trump in 2020, you need to own the fact that you are willingly supporting a racist and enabling him to use the power of the presidency to enact racist policy that will legitimately harm people of color. Doesn't matter what your professed reasons are for supporting him.

On a related note, does anybody else wish Trump would just find a pair of balls and come out and say what is really in his heart? "I really can't stand the n**gers!"

[ 07-29-2019, 01:34 PM: Message edited by: Dragonstone ]

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Dragonstone
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Lockhart's tweet is probably ten times more relevant today than it was when he posted it 9 days ago.

If you vote for Trump in 2020, you are a racist. You can kindly fork off if you want to have a debate about it.

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1000 Masks But No Jobs
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Nothing says thoughtful discussion like fork off if you disagree.

[ 08-07-2019, 11:57 AM: Message edited by: 1000 Masks But No Jobs ]

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Dragonstone
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quote:
Originally posted by 1000 Masks But No Jobs:
Nothing says thoughtful discussion like fork off if you disagree.

There is no thoughtful discussion to be had with people who enable and support wanton racists.
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Travlr
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Not uncommon, lately. The general amazement of some on the Right who can't understand why many on the Left are refusing to put up with their name-calling and enabling any longer:

"But but but....you weren't so unwilling to talk before..."

"Yeah, that's because you stepped over a line that you can't walk back from, and I'm not going to sit here quietly and take it anymore. So, here's your options....."


Variations on a theme from the last three or four years, really. Boils down to, "you weren't listening when we tried to talk before, so now it's too late for talking.....and you aren't prepared for that, are you?"

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Antithesis
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Voting for Trump couldn't possibly be a repudiation of decades of broken neoliberal economic policies that have hollowed out the country, nor could it be rejection of a Democratic party bought off by tech firms and financial interests. The same party that subverted the last primary against a socialist candidate in favor of a clueless plutocrat whose husband Mr. Lockhart served as chief sophist for.

Its all about racism, because identity politics is the only platform corporate democrats have to offer.. like shame ever won an election.

Enjoy another 4 years out in the wilderness with all the other virtuous pagans.

Seriously want to remove a racist from office? Offer the electorate some material benefit that outweighs their inherent fear.

Duh.

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1000 Masks But No Jobs
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quote:
Originally posted by Dragonstone:
quote:
Originally posted by 1000 Masks But No Jobs:
Nothing says thoughtful discussion like fork off if you disagree.

There is no thoughtful discussion to be had with people who enable and support wanton racists.
Are all Mexicans rapists? Of course not. But you are doing the exact same thing as Trump by lumping everyone together as one, homogeneous group.

You only want discussion with people who agree with you politically. Saying everyone on the other side is a racist is just a way of dismissing everyone who does not agree with you.

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